Spirit Of Islam: What Is The Legal Ruling, If Any, On Who Says That Sayyidina Al-imam Al-husayn ('a) Died As A Rebel (na'uzu Billah)? - Spirit Of Islam

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What Is The Legal Ruling, If Any, On Who Says That Sayyidina Al-imam Al-husayn ('a) Died As A Rebel (na'uzu Billah)?

Posted 01 November 2012 - 08:04 AM (#1) User is offline   Alawi 

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There are some ''Sunnis'' today who follow Qadi Abu Bakr al-Maliki in his disgusting opinions. I think the 'ulama need to speak up on this as these ''Sunnis'' are spreading their poison at rapid speeds.
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 09:52 AM (#2) User is offline   Anonymous0514 

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There are some ''Sunnis'' today who follow Qadi Abu Bakr al-Maliki in his disgusting opinions. I think the 'ulama need to speak up on this as these ''Sunnis'' are spreading their poison at rapid speeds

Seriously, why do you need a legal ruling?? They can't be 'Sunnis' as that is not a Sunni position regardless of what they call themselves - why waste any time with people with such views
iaa
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 11:11 AM (#3) User is offline   naqshbandihaqqani 

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Ala Hazrat and the author of Bahar e Shariat are pretty clear on the ruling for such a person 'mustahak e jahanam;; however, I do think it is necessary to show respect to past
scholars and there can be a difference of opinion with Qadi Abu Bakr --who was a great scholar--without calling him 'disgusting'.

Why can't Muslims nowadays tolerate difference of opinion -- even if you don't like it---after all , that is what tolerance means! if you like someone's opinion there isn't much tolerance needed! Scholars --Sunni scholars, great scholars, have held all sorts of opinions in the past.
"My intercession is for my sinful followers" - hadith of Sayyidina Rasool Allah sal Allahu alayhi wa sallam
Shay'an Lillah Ya Shaykh Abd al Qadir! (q)
"Ana'l Haqq!" - Husayn ibn Mansoor al Hallaj (q)
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 12:30 PM (#4) User is offline   Know-the-Ledge 

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As absurd as the opinion seems, surely you would need to investigate the reasoning behind such a conclusion before being able to authoritatively condemn it(?)
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 01:35 PM (#5) User is offline   Anonymous0514 

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As absurd as the opinion seems, surely you would need to investigate the reasoning behind such a conclusion before being able to authoritatively condemn it(?)

Yes for scholarly works maybe but the consensus obviously isn't this position - you might have one or two that hold this view but how many hundreds of thousands of sunni scholars have held the mainstream position and whose work we have to accept as laymen and therefore condemning this position would be fine.
iaa
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 03:43 PM (#6) User is offline   Fatema-the-resplendent 

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He was clearly not a Scholar, for he has not come across the hadith of the Prophet stating that Hasan and Husein will be the leaders of men in Paradise. Or was it that his nasibi tendencies were too strong even for reality? This is not about a difference of opinion but a agenda based statement.

Yazid and his father are the rebels. Fighting a legitimate Caliphate, and oppressing those who stand up to their corruption of the Islamic faith. Husein did not rebel a caliphate, because the caliphate had made a mockery of Islam; whilst it required endorsement from Husein to give it legitimacy. He refused such endorsement therefore the rebellion was against the Imam.

The good news is that he isn't really given credit for his nonsense, Almost everyone in the Muslim world agrees to the legitimacy of imams stance, and praises his character.

...And my mercy embraces all things.

(Surah al araf, Quran)
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 04:35 PM (#7) User is offline   Desert-Sheikh 

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View PostFatema-the-resplendent, on 01 November 2012 - 03:43 PM, said:

The good news is that he isn't really given credit for his nonsense, Almost everyone in the Muslim world agrees to the legitimacy of imams stance, and praises his character.[/font][/size]


Everyone execpt today's fanatic Saudi wahabis and few of their Pakistani devbandi friends. They are rewriting history that there is neither Karbala nor any Yazidi attack on Makkah or Madina.

No need to mention that in Saudi Arabia, Yazid is regarded as amir-ul-dingdong and many people have named their children yazid!

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 04:52 PM (#8) User is offline   qalam 

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View PostDesert-Sheikh, on 01 November 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:


Everyone execpt today's fanatic Saudi wahabis and few of their Pakistani devbandi friends. They are rewriting history that there is neither Karbala nor any Yazidi attack on Makkah or Madina.

No need to mention that in Saudi Arabia, Yazid is regarded as amir-ul-dingdong and many people have named their children yazid!



salam

thats a good asessment i have been herefor 2 years and i have had many yazeed's in my class and no Hasan or Hussains.


dr aq
Dr AQ- Product of a classcial education , fee paying of course!
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 08:07 PM (#9) User is offline   Know-the-Ledge 

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It is a culture of refutation and tarnishing. Islamic activism seems to consist of nothing more than digging through the words of scholars to find something controversial to parade. The anti-Wahhabi and and anti-Deobandi stuff has become boring. Soon the anti-convert-scholar stuff will become boring and now it's the anti-old scholars.

Forgery was a common device employed by antagonists to sully reputations. In the days before printing presses, it was quite an easy method of beguiling. How do we know for a fact that this isn't such a cynical manouver lost for centuries now being brought up? Ignoring that, provide evidences and counter opinions to fully realise an academic ambition, otherwise it's just intellectual-impetuousness

Besmirching his credentials, character and motives, seems to be the tabloid style intellectualism that's becoming common on yb.
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 10:12 PM (#10) User is offline   Mudassar-Rana 

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View PostDesert-Sheikh, on 01 November 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:


Everyone execpt today's fanatic Saudi wahabis and few of their Pakistani devbandi friends. They are rewriting history that there is neither Karbala nor any Yazidi attack on Makkah or Madina.

No need to mention that in Saudi Arabia, Yazid is regarded as amir-ul-dingdong and many people have named their children yazid!



i have a few arab customers that are named yazid and one really feels sorry for them.

With regards to the people considering imam hussein a.s a rebel then i think they use the ahadith that one must obey the caliph even if he beats you and the hadith that if someone comes to divide you i.e a second caliph, strike his neck.

Unfortunately its a one eyed opinion for 2 reasons firstly imam hussein a.s didnt go to stage a coup d'etat as he took his family with him - he walked to certain death to awaken the ummah. No one in history has staged a coup with women and kids and imam hussein a.s wasnt a kid or politically unaware he grew up in the household of rasool s.a.w, fatima and ali a.s. This walk to death is without doubt the most bravest in human history.

Secondly this same yardstick isnt used for amir muawiyah despite the fact that he actually waged war against a righteous caliph i.e ali a.s and then against his son imam hassan a.s. So its intellectual dishonesty and opinion making for sectarian purposes.
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Posted 01 November 2012 - 10:30 PM (#11) User is offline   The-Mughal-Sister 

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This is not Islam! This is mere politics!
“Your knowledge must improve your heart, and purge your ego.”

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 10:55 PM (#12) User is offline   Brother_MGS 

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Beautiful picture brother/sister Alawi. The Ghumari Sadaat are fantastic Muhaddiths, most the Arab Shayukh of the past century have directly or indirectly taken from their knowledge.

Sayyiduna Imam Hussain(A) is alive in the heart of all true believers, I believe that is enough.

As the Chishti Prince of Ajmer beautifully states Hussain is King.

Them three words speak oceans.

The fadhail of Imam Hussain(A) and his noble household(A) alone defeat this arguement.
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Posted 06 November 2012 - 08:40 AM (#13) User is offline   Alawi 

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View PostKnow-the-Ledge, on 01 November 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:


Forgery was a common device employed by antagonists to sully reputations. In the days before printing presses, it was quite an easy method of beguiling. How do we know for a fact that this isn't such a cynical manouver lost for centuries now being brought up? Ignoring that, provide evidences and counter opinions to fully realise an academic ambition, otherwise it's just intellectual-impetuousness




In this case, contemporary scholars of Qadi Abu Bakr have documented his absurd view. It's also strengthened by the same reoccurring theme in a few of his other texts.
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Posted 06 November 2012 - 08:53 AM (#14) User is offline   Tahir-Riaz 

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View PostThe-Mughal-Sister, on 01 November 2012 - 10:30 PM, said:

This is not Islam! This is mere politics!


There are rights and wrongs in politics as well. We must side with what is right; we must side with Imam Hussain (as). Having said that, Imam Hussain (as) sacrificed his life for a cause and not politics.
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Posted 06 November 2012 - 08:54 AM (#15) User is offline   Alawi 

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View Postsunniskeptic, on 01 November 2012 - 11:11 AM, said:

however, I do think it is necessary to show respect to past
scholars and there can be a difference of opinion with Qadi Abu Bakr --who was a great scholar--without calling him 'disgusting'.



I technically did not call him disgusting my brother, I said his opinion most definitely was. And even if I did, hypothetically speaking, what is the problem? Stating that Imam al-Husayn al-Sibt ('alayhi al-salam) died as a rebel, is not just textually incompatible but also manifests certain evils of the heart. I fear for my own iman in not calling such a person disgusting.
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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:26 PM (#16) User is offline   naqshbandihaqqani 

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I stand corrected my bro. If anyone says Imam Hussain (a.s.) was a rebel (Arabic: baghi) that person is definitely disgusting and a dog of hell.





"My intercession is for my sinful followers" - hadith of Sayyidina Rasool Allah sal Allahu alayhi wa sallam
Shay'an Lillah Ya Shaykh Abd al Qadir! (q)
"Ana'l Haqq!" - Husayn ibn Mansoor al Hallaj (q)
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Posted 01 December 2012 - 06:31 AM (#17) User is offline   H@ydR 

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Enter the Kingdom, you will find a Madrasa named after Yazid ibn Muawiya (la).

Can you imagine an islamic school named after a drunkard, oppressor, womanising and murderer caliph, students there learn about Islam? or Nasibism, one needs to ponder.

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“Prophet (s) said: ‘When I went on Miraj I saw on the Pillars of Arsh an inscription, which I read and understood as “There is No God but Allah, Muhamad is the Messenger of Allah, I have supported him with Ali ”’.
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Posted 01 December 2012 - 09:17 AM (#18) User is offline   naqshbandihaqqani 

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No surprise there, we know the Wahabis and the Devbandis are Yazeedis (with a few exceptions)...just go to any Salafi or Deobandi forum and search for Yazid and more often than not you will find people defending that ma'loon!



View PostH@ydR, on 01 December 2012 - 06:31 AM, said:

Enter the Kingdom, you will find a Madrasa named after Yazid ibn Muawiya (la).

Can you imagine an islamic school named after a drunkard, oppressor, womanising and murderer caliph, students there learn about Islam? or Nasibism, one needs to ponder.



"My intercession is for my sinful followers" - hadith of Sayyidina Rasool Allah sal Allahu alayhi wa sallam
Shay'an Lillah Ya Shaykh Abd al Qadir! (q)
"Ana'l Haqq!" - Husayn ibn Mansoor al Hallaj (q)
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Posted 01 December 2012 - 11:53 AM (#19) User is offline   H@ydR 

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Powerful response by Ayatollah Modarresi to Saudi Yazidiyat!




“Prophet (s) said: ‘When I went on Miraj I saw on the Pillars of Arsh an inscription, which I read and understood as “There is No God but Allah, Muhamad is the Messenger of Allah, I have supported him with Ali ”’.
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