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Is This Appropriate Behaviour By A Religious Scholar?

Posted 04 March 2012 - 03:23 PM (#1) User is offline   qadrimuslim 

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At approx 2:50 into the video, a man who looks like a practicing Muslim, stands to ask a question in a Masjid and is verbally abused and physically attacked by the Maulana and then jumped by the others. The camera is turned away through the violence but you can still hear the beating sounds. After the man is subdued they shout Takbeer!

This is probably not going to surprise most people and some on the forum would prefer it not to be shown but we cannot bury our heads in the sand.

This extremism and hatred is rife in our ranks and is being propagated and encouraged by mullahs we see in Sunni Masajid and on some TV Channels.

Yesterday it was hate speech and swearing from the Mimbar, today its fighting in Masajid, tomorrow all out violence and war.

Is this Islam? what do we do about it?




"The Sufi Must Submit to the Faqih" - Shaykh Ahmad Zurruq (RA)

Wa-la Ghalib Il-Allah "There is no Conqueror but Allah"
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 03:52 PM (#2) User is offline   Super_Duper 

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This is a sign of pure ego, the way he says to the man, tou hai kaun. He's basically saying that he is better then him. Correct if I am wrong but isn't using this language (calling someone a kutta) a characteristic of a fasiq?
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 04:00 PM (#3) User is offline   piara-madinah 

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Astaghfirullah , real sayeds never talk like he is talking and can he show the certificate that he is from bani hashim.

Where is his ikhlaq gone , sayed need ikhlaq as well .
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 04:06 PM (#4) User is offline   qalam 

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salam

you cannot do anything in pakistan but here in the uk you are also powerless as the big peers are supporting such philistine terrporists


dr aq
Dr AQ- Product of a classcial education , fee paying of course!
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 04:44 PM (#5) User is offline   Qadri-Jilani 

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This is actually a very disturbing video. It's upsetting. He starts swearing (in local Gujrati-Punjabi) lingo at the man asking questions . He then hits and pokes the questioner with his walking stick and orders his cronies to beat him. What I found most upsetting is when they push the camera away you can hear the sticks beating him and we have no idea what happened to the poor man. I really felt sorry him.

This behaviour seriously needs addressing, it's so wretched and it pains me to watch it as it's not only a true reflection of some of the mullas but also gives such a bad name to Pakistan.

Maslak-e-Ahl-e-Sunnat

jarahat al-sinani laha'l-tiyamu ma yaltamu jarahat al-lisani
ei biradar chu 'aqibat khakast, khaak shawesh az ankei khaak shawee
apni millat par qiyas aqwam-e-maghrib sei na kar, khas hei tarkeeb mein qawm-e-Rasool-e-Hashmi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 05:02 PM (#6) User is offline   naqshbandihaqqani 

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btw 'you' doesn't mean a single person but the mod team in general!
O marvel! A garden amidst the flames! My heart has become capable of every form:
it is a pasture for gazelles, and a convent for Christian monks,A temple for idols, and the pilgrim's Ka'ba,
the tables of the Torah and the book of the Quran. I follow the religion of Love: whatever way
Love's camels take, that is my religion and my faith.

-Ibn Arabi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 05:03 PM (#7) User is offline   naqshbandihaqqani 

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View PostQadri-Jilani, on 04 March 2012 - 04:44 PM, said:

This is actually a very disturbing video. It's upsetting. He starts swearing at the man asking questions in local Gujrati-Punjabi lingo. He then hits and pokes the questioner with his walking stick and orders his cronies to beat him. What I found most upsetting is when they push the camera away you can hear the sticks beating him and we have no idea what happened to the poor man. I really felt sorry him.

This behaviour seriously needs addressing, it's so wretched and it pains me to watch it as it's not only a true reflection of some of the mullas but also gives such a bad name to Pakistan.



if you change 'some mullah's to MOST mullahs you'll be more accurate brother QJ.
O marvel! A garden amidst the flames! My heart has become capable of every form:
it is a pasture for gazelles, and a convent for Christian monks,A temple for idols, and the pilgrim's Ka'ba,
the tables of the Torah and the book of the Quran. I follow the religion of Love: whatever way
Love's camels take, that is my religion and my faith.

-Ibn Arabi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 05:07 PM (#8) User is offline   Qadri-Jilani 

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View PostSlave_of_the_Two_Husayns, on 04 March 2012 - 05:03 PM, said:

if you change 'some mullah's to MOST mullahs you'll be more accurate brother QJ.


I think "some" is more accurate as such unprovoked language (habitual) and moreover, ordering the beating of a single individual by a crowd in this manner is not often seen but it does, unfortunately, reflect a certain mad mulla mentality.

Maslak-e-Ahl-e-Sunnat

jarahat al-sinani laha'l-tiyamu ma yaltamu jarahat al-lisani
ei biradar chu 'aqibat khakast, khaak shawesh az ankei khaak shawee
apni millat par qiyas aqwam-e-maghrib sei na kar, khas hei tarkeeb mein qawm-e-Rasool-e-Hashmi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 05:24 PM (#9) User is offline   qalam 

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salam


very bad very bad indeed.

Swearing at the gentleman calling him a dog and towards the end he continues his onslaught with the beating up being deputed to his cronies.


no wnder the ummah is in this state


dr aq
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 05:35 PM (#10) User is offline   Fatema-the-resplendent 

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What this man does no longer surprises me, he is vile human being who obviously is poorly educated. It is so disturbing that I am thinking if any other Maulana Sahab has been as awful as him, that too on the pulpit. He has no right to call anyone a Dog and brandish his walking stick threatening to hit him. His speech before then is also confrontational and charged, he is a very angry man, poor educational background with a village mentality. This is what happens when you put that mix into the Mosque as Imam. May Allah save us all from such 'Ulema'.

As for the poor man, we never did find out the reason why he was beaten and what question he wanted to ask. As for the audience well I'm sure they think there is better entertainment in the Mosques these days than the local Cinema! Free aswell.

Irfan Shah Sahab is a lost cause, he swears in Mosques, He preaches intolerance and hate and is obviously a harsh tongued person.

The question is, What do we think God will do with such people?, they are guilty of so many crimes.

Lutf-e-mai tujh se kya kahu’n zahid
Haae kambakht tu ne pi hi nahi’n
-Daagh Dehlvi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 05:46 PM (#11) User is offline   Fekay 

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There's other videos of Irfan shah sahib going loose with tongue on mimbar e rasool swearing without any hesistation at all. How can someone whos tagged a 'scholar', a role model, lack such basics?
.
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 05:54 PM (#12) User is offline   Qadri-Jilani 

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I would assume he might have questioned the vile language he uses but sister do not give him the privilege of being from the Ulama. Alim is a noble title is not befitting for people of such retarded and vulgar character. As for such behaviour coming from a syed then the comments on youtube suggest something else.
Maslak-e-Ahl-e-Sunnat

jarahat al-sinani laha'l-tiyamu ma yaltamu jarahat al-lisani
ei biradar chu 'aqibat khakast, khaak shawesh az ankei khaak shawee
apni millat par qiyas aqwam-e-maghrib sei na kar, khas hei tarkeeb mein qawm-e-Rasool-e-Hashmi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 06:32 PM (#13) User is offline   The-Mughal-Sister 

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Sad times.

The fact his audience cheer him on and indulge in the violent behaviour isn't surprising.

Just sad times. Real sad.

“Your knowledge must improve your heart, and purge your ego.”

Imam Ghazzali RA
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 06:36 PM (#14) User is offline   Mudassar-Rana 

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I have a different take on this! Judge the man by the audience he has and things should become clearer.

If pir ever meant guide, saviour - that meaning does not apply this century!
my brothers are those who will believe in me, without having seen me.” [Ahmad, Musnad]

Jaag Muslmaan Jaag Muslmaan ... kitna naacho gai ghairon ki dhun par?Jis ummat mein rab ne sher paida kiye aaj wohi gheedar ka libaas apna muqaddar samjh bethi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 07:06 PM (#15) User is offline   YaNabi-Chemist 

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View PostSlave_of_the_Two_Husayns, on 04 March 2012 - 04:51 PM, said:

This is wrong but I seriously question the motives of you posting this on here. You have obvious motives against Irfan Shah sahib as he is
against your own pir sahib. it is okay to post such videos on here but the moment someone posts videos of either pir abdul qadir shah sahib or prof. tahir ul qadri
which are also dodgy you either ban the person, or delete the video, or both saying we don't tolerate such fitna mongering on here!







It was made clear to you from that outset that you are welcome to express a view however we will NOT tolerate your slanderous tone.

You continued with your slander and were banned for a week.

They very fact that you are allowed to post freely once again shows that it's nothing to do with peer politics, but your lack in basic adhab when addressing peoples shaykhs. All subsequent posts about your ban will be deleted / result in a further ban at the moderators discretion.

Stop brooding over it....

Back to the video - It's outrageous behavior and The authoroties here in the UK need to be informed about this man.

This post has been edited by YaNabi-Chemist: 04 March 2012 - 07:11 PM

Feel free to PM me if you have any health issues / ailments.

Confidentiality will be maintained.
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 09:09 PM (#16) User is offline   qadrimuslim 

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Sunni Skeptik, get over your yourself.. this is not about any bickering between Pirs but the damage this is causing to Ahlus Sunnah

Please show me or tell me of any other Maulana, Pir or Shaykh who is propagating such hatred and violence


"The Sufi Must Submit to the Faqih" - Shaykh Ahmad Zurruq (RA)

Wa-la Ghalib Il-Allah "There is no Conqueror but Allah"
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 09:59 PM (#17) User is offline   Mudassar-Rana 

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View Postqadrimuslim, on 04 March 2012 - 09:09 PM, said:

Sunni Skeptik, get over your yourself.. this is not about any bickering between Pirs but the damage this is causing to Ahlus Sunnah

Please show me or tell me of any other Maulana, Pir or Shaykh who is propagating such hatred and violence




Bro Qm - Regardless of the personality politics I beleive one of the biggest reasons behind these pir cults is the oxygen they get from the tv channels. The channels though they have a disclaimer saying we do not endorse views should realise that once allowing some one air space are giving some sort of endorsement to the personality. Therefore it is incumbent upon them to exercise great care when inviting people on to their programmes. Ummah Channel for some reason has taken it upon themselves to really take the deobandi's, shia and the other brelvi viewpoints head on. Though it has lessened recently probably due to ofcom - Its really uncalled for. To call yourself ummah channel and then concentrate on promoting a particularly extreme takfiri form of brelvism leads to this type of personality cult.

Even if its not irfan shah saab it will be another - everybody is after creating a name for themselves - and the more extreme their views the more name they make for themselves.

At this current moment in time the people at large are not of that calibre to call to account ulema with reason and therefore this leads to different groupings. Rather like some people prefer cornflakes other sugar puffs and so on. So each type of person has a matching pir or personality cult for themselves.

The most disturbing thing in the video is not the profanity nor the violence from shah saab but the ignorance of the people in the audience who rush to attack the person as if there was a gold rush. One big word JAHALAT!

Not to say that the person asking the question was innocent - maybe he was there as an agent provocateur - but even then the response should never have been like this. Whether its pir abdul qadir or irfan shah or any other personality we the ummah should have enough iman to call wrong wrong.
my brothers are those who will believe in me, without having seen me.” [Ahmad, Musnad]

Jaag Muslmaan Jaag Muslmaan ... kitna naacho gai ghairon ki dhun par?Jis ummat mein rab ne sher paida kiye aaj wohi gheedar ka libaas apna muqaddar samjh bethi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 10:07 PM (#18) User is offline   hamzaahmad123 

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Why do you even bother uploading this stuff. Yes we all know you HATE Pir Irfan Shah,
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 10:09 PM (#19) User is offline   naqshbandihaqqani 

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About the video, I agree it is not very good manners by Sayyid Irfan Shah sahib but I think it is more the fault of people who follow and keep on going 'wah wah' as
it encourages these scholars. Honestly, I am sure there must be some decent,upright, god-fearing scholars amongst the Indo-Pakistani diaspora, but I am beginning
to ever despair of finding one!

However, in the video, it is not clear either what Shah Sahib said or what the man who was harassed was trying to say...yet I totally condemn the actions.

--
We have put ourselves in this position by our blind veneration for the title 'sayyid' and 'pir' and 'Sunni'...

--
Look, Pakistani ulema are just a microcosm of Pakistani society as a whole; if the whole society is a majority of uncouth and unlettered people, you cannot expect the ulema who come
from within them to be any different.

We're a sick society.
O marvel! A garden amidst the flames! My heart has become capable of every form:
it is a pasture for gazelles, and a convent for Christian monks,A temple for idols, and the pilgrim's Ka'ba,
the tables of the Torah and the book of the Quran. I follow the religion of Love: whatever way
Love's camels take, that is my religion and my faith.

-Ibn Arabi
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Posted 04 March 2012 - 10:19 PM (#20) User is offline   piara-madinah 

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View PostQadri-Jilani, on 04 March 2012 - 04:44 PM, said:

This is actually a very disturbing video. It's upsetting. He starts swearing (in local Gujrati-Punjabi) lingo at the man asking questions . He then hits and pokes the questioner with his walking stick and orders his cronies to beat him. What I found most upsetting is when they push the camera away you can hear the sticks beating him and we have no idea what happened to the poor man. I really felt sorry him.

This behaviour seriously needs addressing, it's so wretched and it pains me to watch it as it's not only a true reflection of some of the mullas but also gives such a bad name to Pakistan.



more upsetting why he is claiming that he is from sayyeds etc when he cant keep there respect , the best man is among us who got best ikhlaq manners and taqwa and what he is representing that if he is sayyed he is allowed to do anything but he is wrong but the real sayeeds never act like that.

even a good human never act as he is acting.
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