[YaNabi-Chemist]

Salaam, I just want to share a story with you, and your views would be welcome.

I work part time caring for disabled individuals over the weekend, I’ve worked with dozens of individuals with varying degrees of disabilities, from partially sighted kids to grown men with the mental age of a baby (thus in nappies).

Earlier today I was with a client, a fully grown man, but with severe learning difficulty. He has the mental age of a child and simply loves going to the mosque. Unfortunately, he had a little accident near the wudu facilities where he wet himself as he couldn’t wait for the toilet.

This has NEVER happened before and he is fully continent. His family was surprised at this rare occurrence. It happened with people walking past and most didn’t realise. I needed help to clean up; I saw some dawat-e-islami guys and asked them to help ie call the care taker etc. I was expecting a great deal of help from these guys who go around preaching with their long beards and costume.

One of them asked for the caretaker. They didn’t come close to my client and didn’t even try to comfort him or anything. They waited for me outside and then basically told me that it’s not allowed to bring him to the mosque, even if he has nappies on, it’s not allowed to bring an impure thing to the mosque – This is a human being we are talking about and it’s never happened before. He comes to the mosque almost every day!

They said I should have known better never to bring him here blab la bla imagine if he did it in prayer hall. They even had a problem with him sitting on a stool to put his shoes on saying he is dirtying the stool etc I mean, is the honour of a disabled person worth less than a stool that can be cleaned later?

I can guarantee you, in a church I would have probably been given some new clothes for him to wear at the least. Allot of my co-workers have the same problems with the mosque attendees saying it’s haraam to bring such and such to the masjid. Ie a person with autism who may have a seizure etc but I was just saddened at the response from these guys. I was honestly happy to see them and perceived that I would get allot of help and support, not being told off for bringing him here in the first place!

I tend not to argue with people I don’t know so I didn’t say anything to them.

This post has been edited by YaNabi-Chemist: 22 January 2012 - 09:56 PM

[Fatema-the-resplendent]

How kind and warm were these bearded Men MashAllah.

Allah will not be pleased they barred someone from the Mosque due to their poor perception of mental disability. Not even helping him clean up kind of shows their hard-heartedness.

And I think you should have said what you thought, and give them examples of the Prophet's kindness to Animals.

Allah ka ghar hai unka ghar nahin hai.

[YaNabi-Chemist]

Yeh, but to be honest I just wanted to get him home ASAP. I was too saddened to say anything to these people. A real let down.

[qalam]

salam

no wonder the DI crew have a massive problem in prosletyzing thieir views in 21st century uk

dr aq

[Luhif]

Really sad and heart breaking story.A hadith came to my mind as soon as I read this.Its about when a person from village comes to Masjid-e-Nabawi and starts urinating in the main prayer hall (Jamat khana) and all Sahaba's(may Allah be pleased with them all) try to rush at him to stop him doing that but our beloved Propher(peace be upon Him) stops them all and says let him finish.When he finishes, the Prophet(peace be upon Him) calls him and educates him in the best way that this is the house of Allah and we should not make it impure with anything.The villager understands his mistake and apologises.(Please correct me if anything in this Hadith is wrong)What a beautiful way of our Prophet(peace be upon Him) I really think you should go back next time and tell them about this Hadith.

I also would like to state that why do we always blame the beard? I mean, do you think if they didnt have a beard, they could have done any better? Isnt it about their education of Deen or humanity which they lack probably? Would you say the same for a beardless guy like "those beardless guys didnt help or did this and that".Blame the guy's education why blame the beard? If we blame the beard so what is the difference between us and the media who has been projecting bearded muslims as bad guys from decades or is it the case that we have been so conditioned that we think the same way?When a good muslim with long beard does something good, do you praise the beard or the brother? I hope you dont praise the beard, lol.Beard is one of the most beloved sunnah(attire wise so please dont shoot me with "internal beauty is more important" or anything along those lines) to the Prophet(peace be upon Him).That is how our Prophet(peace be upon Him) and all other Prophets(peace be upon them All) and all Sahaba(may Allah be pleased with them All) and all great scholars used to look! With long beards.

[Khalid_the_Warrior]

YaNabi-Chemist, on 22 January 2012 - 10:09 PM, said:

Yeh, but to be honest I just wanted to get him home ASAP. I was too saddened to say anything to these people. A real let down.

Its indeed very sad. They should have been more helpful.

But I believe blaming an individual or organisation for these types of behaviours is not going to serve the purpose properly. Why don't we tackle it more responsively and deliberate this as behaviour of most Asian Muslims towards disabled people.

Instead of overlooking or ignoring them, you should have tried to explain your reasoning and try to make them understand it from both moral and Islamic point of view. They may be wearing nice cloths, beards and Imama's but they are no scholars and are just like any ordinary Muslims.

You should have conveyed the message and then leave it to them to accept it or reject it. Just ignoring it won't solve anything!!!

[The-Mughal-Sister]

I don't find mosques welcoming for the able bodied people, especially women.

It's not inviting, they don't cater for people's needs and it's the building they cherish rather than the people or what is being taught, or how it is helping the community.

It's like a museum at times.

I like how the priest stands outside the church and the doors are open for everyone. I want to visit a church, just out of curiosity but don't know if I should.

Real sorry to hear about your experience Brother Faraz, such a shame.

This post has been edited by The-Mughal-Sister: 22 January 2012 - 10:44 PM

[Fatema-the-resplendent]

@ Br Luhif

The point about beards is that the sacred-ness of it is not respected with such actions. It is disrespectful to your own beard. It is exactly like that when a woman who wears hijab is doing unkind things, you should respect the mark of faith you wear.

Ofcourse the beard is a beautiful Sunnah of our Prophet.

@ TMS

I went to a Cathedral in Liverpool not so long ago, It is beautiful. The Church is organised, people are paid for their services. But it lacks spirituality in my view, there were more visitors than actual worshippers. Atleast in a Masjid people keep it alive by Namaz.

BTW there is one in the city centre I've been to that one too. But then i have always had a fascination with Churches.

[Know-the-Ledge]

I would love to adduce the text I sent to Faraz over this incident which he told me about. It was full of bitter truisms, I would love to share with you my colourful and incisive bang-on-the-money analysis of the given situation, the perfect analogy for such smarms, but I best not.

p.s I do not blame DI but these individuals involved.

[Mudassar-Rana]

it'd probably be unfair to tarnish the whole DI - you would hope that the majority would know better.
What the story tells u is that those guys missed out on a massive opportunity to earn jannah.

his incontinence may have been a one of - but that one of was an opportunity that rabb ul alimeen allowed these people to gain the pleasure of their lord.

On many an occasion i have noticed with DI members that they are more hardline than the wahabbi's they so hate! Indeed a momin is nothing if he is not soft hearted.

[gujjubond]

it's not about DI but any group who has ignored modernism as a whole, and don't try to integrate into modern society... you find lots of incidence like this with Tabligi Jamat or Wahhabi salafi followers and now a days with our barelwi brothers too...

recent incident locally where our Muslim Long beard CABIE refused to onboard blind person with his dog because dog is impure in islam. Cabie was sued for discrimination and his company had to pay at Human right tribunal.

This is due to just embarrassing only outer costumes of Islam and ignoring inner beauty of Sufism..

there is a thread going on other forum www.Sunnah ...com, where they are arguing that why Sikh was allowed on noor tv to speak on Bulley shah ? and why Shaykh nazim hugged and kissed POP ? is it allow in islam to hug non muslim ?

this is very sad ...

[Quran-Reciter]

Sick minded individuals, phiteh moo!

You have every rigth to be disgusted, i cannot imagine how a parent would have felt if his grown child was treated in such a maner, i personally would take legal action agaisnt the authorities in question.

[Know-the-Ledge]

"Come come, whoever you are, please come come again, Religious, Pagan, Infidel, heretic..." - rumi

I'm deeply infuriated and QR is right legal action to do their backsides nanga is the only way to teach theae roti-riders a lesson.


@ftr I actually went to a Roman Catholic School, Primary and Secondary and the Primary was a Church school and the Church was Awesome, huge and archaic, the architecture was very quaint and the moods...So serene and peaceful!! Yet I was lambasted on this forum a while ago for saying this lal but I actually hark back with great nostalgia and agree with what you say, imaan keh sath i'd love to visit it again.

This post has been edited by Know-The-Ledge: 23 January 2012 - 10:25 AM

[Major-Screw-Loose]

I don't think I would have minded in assisting the disabled man's needs and problems, i.e. cleaning up and I would've done it for free. Afterall its about helping humanity no matter who they are, black, white, able or disable, Muslim or non-Muslim, tall, short, young or old, fat or grey.

I work as a cleaner so for me any sort of cleaning is not a problem.

May be those DI brothers forgot the thing about 'help another fellow Muslim or help another human being/humanity in distress or in need', something which our faith Islam teaches.

Yanabi-Chemist, please voice your concerns in the Your Comments section of Telegraph and Argus newspaper, or at least how about you arrange for a lecture/biyaan probably at the same DI masjid where the talk would be about humans helping another human and human's and Muslims helping disabled people during times of difficulty and in hardship. Then may be a few guys might learn a thing or two and may realise how they should treat another human being who is less able than them.

[GunmetalGrey]

Could this incidence be more a reflection of the unfamiliarity some Muslims may experience around the disabled more than a hatred/negligence towards them? I'm not excusing them for treating the poor brother like that, but I've not seen efforts being done to raise awareness of subtler conditions such as dyslexia, autism and the likes, and especially how the Prophet (sal Allaahu 'alayhi wassalam) treated them with kindness.

[AhmadAli]

Sallam,

Allah hu akbar! Not every is dawat-e-islami wearing Green Imama Shareef ect -Sayyadi Ameer Ahle Sunnat Hafidhullahu ta'ala!... Dawat-e-Islami are those who learn and act upon the Sacred Knowledge Of Islam! Dawat-e-islami is no just for those who wear the green Imama shareef and White Madani clothes ect... Even Nacheez has been through these sort of incidents, like yesterday I tried to tell one of Dawat-e-Islami "follower", what you just did is wrong especially wearing the Green imama Shareef as well as Sunnah Beard. We have these things with us so Respect it! Have 'adab, be humble, then again not every one is same like many others who I met yesterday event that took place, alhamdulillah azzawajjal very nice and humble brothers! I have been going to Ijtimah's for a while now, mashAllah there are many brothers who are true Lovers with humble 'amal and Ikhlas, then There those who are not, and thats not the majority. In my area there where brothers who were at first not what they are now A True Ashiqu Rasool which they try Acting upon there Knowledge they gain, at time they first couldn't act upon the True Teachings of islam now that they are alhamdulillah azzawajjal changes have come, it takes time. I would request please with The Bless Sunnah of the Prophet of Allah SalAllahu alahi wasallam in your output also have input as well. Who Is perfect amongst us today, we blame each others and point at each others mistakes and ponder upon our self and to be honest thats when it all goes wrong and then don't see the true colours the true changes within our selfs and if we Acted upon what we learn then ofcourse we wouldn't be who we are! I feel sometimes its me Who is wrong and making mistakes on certain occasions as this does happen, although I am a big gunhagar siakaar so on, But People Do Say He is A Good Person, so humble and so on, but I say, am not worthy of even being called this because that's what we are are suppose be, A Muslim With Good Character!!! That's when true changes take place and that's when People started to accept islam Through Good Character of a Individual. The character of A Muslim makes the difference, Aaj humari wah wah hoti hai, kaal kia pataa qabr wich hamari kiya halat hogi...


Oh God! Oh God! I cannot see!My eyes are Blind! Am I still Me Or has my soul been led astray, And forced to pay a Priceless Fee Alas to Dust we all return, Some shall rejoice, while others burn, If only I knew that before The line grew short, and came my Turn!

SalAllahu 'Aala Sayyadina Muhammad SalAllahu alahi wasallam

[warea]

Actually, tw's judgemental behaviour is more problematic. Not everyone is perfect Insan kamil. Why not instead look over their suggestion to be due to their obedience to law regarding the entering of impurity in a mosque rather than portraying it as some wicked individuals hiding behind a beard? Why have you forgetten the Islamic rule of hiding the faults of believers ?

[GunmetalGrey]

warea, on 23 January 2012 - 02:45 PM, said:

Actually, tw's judgemental behaviour is more problematic. Not everyone is perfect Insan kamil. Why not instead look over their suggestion to be due to their obedience to law regarding the entering of impurity in a mosque rather than portraying it as some wicked individuals hiding behind a beard? Why have you forgetten the Islamic rule of hiding the faults of believers ?

Well, why not focus on the clear problem our Muslim community has with dealing with the disabled? I don't think the original post went and exposed anyone's sins, unless he named them all by person...

Let us focus on the issues behind their behaviour, instead of trying to defend the institution for their behaviour towards the brother with learning difficulties.

[warea]

I don't see any real systematic or traditional oppression of disabled being committed by muslims. This is a non-issue and comes under the millions of such mistakes and slips that occur by Muslims due to 1000 different factors. If the tw had instead explained what the right thing a Muslim has to do in such situation and then explained the maslaha with regards to the impurity in a masjid and how this situation should be holistically handled, it would been service. Right now all that is done is completely unjust generalisation of Dawateislami as a whole for the actions of some unknown individual, exaggeration of the incident, hidden "holier than thou"-ism, and such rhetoric that is harmful.

Two examples come to mind. The advise of a Habib al Saqqaf on YouTube criticising those who shout at people in rage when a muslims mobile phone rings in a masjid and instead advising the use of honest patient advise in secrecy keeping in mind the intention and goal of advise and keeping the honour of the Muslim intact.

The example a Quran teacher taught me. That if a person waiting in tiresome for a bus or taxi and happens to see his friend or someone he knows closely passing by in his car, but doesn't stop for you or help you; we shouldn't jump to conclusion and make judgement of how that person never stopped for you and be a bigshot questioning his honesty or so forth. But instead assume that he had something more urgent that he could not stop or that he did not notice you or some other excuse.

[badman]

Salams,

A few years ago I was doing Iteqaf at our main Masjid (Ramazaan back then was in the middle of the winter) after breaking the fast a few people would stay behind till Isha and Taraweeah. One night a middle aged bloke walked into the Mosque, he was drunk,cold and starving, the guy came in to the prayer hall with his shoes on (he was murmuring in an afro-carrabean accent) these old guys who were in the Mosque (you should have seen them) they wanted to beat this guy up. they started pushing him around (using nice colourful language) me and my big gob did not take it so I interevened, the people started having a go at me told them whats the problem if he's walked in with his shoes? (clean it up after - I'll clean up after) told them they were not right in the head (they were not happy). the poor guy started crying he was in his fifties had been drinking all day (apparantly he was struggling with life) felt sorry for the guy. we gave him our food to eat, he was shaking and all sorts, theres some nasty/cruel people in this wicked world. Muslims Fasting, praying the Quran (being/in the Month Of Mercy) yet not practicing what they have inherited by God's Grace. Unbeleivable!!!


@ Faraz, you should have said something to them! our people are liking 'walking dead' they need to be woken up from their deep Freeze!!!


@ FTR....Wahaaay Yes, Liverpool is a fine city (I think its the only city outside of London to boast an Anglican and a Roman Catholic Cathedral in one city) last year (2010) we was invited to a carol concert at the Catholic Cathedral by our Friend Margeret (could not go - I fell Ill) My Brother and Nephew went they enjoyed it. You know you should go visiting places of worship of different faiths (at many a times we can learn so much from their hospitality - May ALLAH guide us all to the straight path) Ive been to a hindu temple - came out with a banging headache, LolZ! Did you go to the maritime museam? theres a museam on the 'black slaves' where they show (footage) of how Africans were traded in Liverpool and sent to America - they had to endure some unbelievable circumstances!

@ KTL, You are old school (stay that way) - instead of our people coming into the 21st centuary there going back into the 19th. Lambasted for talking about Church's??? yet the same people not give a mouthful when 'the ummah' commit benifit fraud and all sorts of unmoral behaviour towards the host. Unbelivable - the intolerant behaviour of what Faraz went through. they in their deluded minds think theyre better than others (trait of Ahle Kitaab - we always seem to think we are better than everyone else)


Did people know the first purpose made Mosque in Britain was opened in Liverpool (by Liverpool's famous and good Son, Abdullah Quilliam - May ALLAH have Mercy on his Soul) the (now closed Masjid) which is on West Derby Rd (Islington) was opened a good few years before the officially recognised Mosque - 'the Shah Jahan Masjid in Woking. I was told recently that during Christmas time back then (late 1880's-1890's) Abdullah Quilliam would have the Mosque opened up and those who were from poor families would get invited for Christmas Dinner!

Its a shame we number in Quantity yet lack so much in Quality!