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What are the beliefs of wahabi and are qadianies and ahmadiaes the same? Wahabi and Qadiani

Posted 28 July 2005 - 12:49 PM (#1) User is offline   mud_785 

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What are the beliefs of these two groups?

What is wrong in thier beliefs could some brothers/sisters give me an insight into this topic. I am not encouraging any of these but I want to learn more about these two groups.


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Posted 28 July 2005 - 12:56 PM (#2) User is offline   Husayni 

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Qadiani-kaffir
http://www.yanabi.com/forum/categories.cfm?catid=44&zb=4497830

http://www.yanabi.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=44&threadid=4189&enterthread=y


http://www.yanabi.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=44&threadid=4913&enterthread=y


http://www.yanabi.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=44&threadid=5635&enterthread=y

these are a few threads..
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Posted 28 July 2005 - 12:58 PM (#3) User is offline   irfanrazakhan 

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Walaykumsalaam,


Number 1, Wahabbis are considered as Muslims and a sect within Islam.
Ahmadis/Qadianis however cannot be called MUSLIMs as they are kafir and have nothing to do with Islam, because their leader namely Mirza Qadiani made a false claim to prophet hood, No matter how much we hate wahabbis there is no comparison between these to, ahmadis/qadianis are a cult outside the fold of islam.. Yes wahabbis are gustakh but they are still considered as the ummah of syedina Muhammad yes they are filthy, with only determination to spread filth, but we are in no position to make comparison of them with qadiani's and ahmedis..

The common factor they have is both are gustakh rasool  (disrespectful to holy prophet)      

Some consider Wahabbis to be the root cause of ahamdis/and qadianis? and many many believe the wahabiis= ahle hadith to be teachers of maloon mirza qadiani hence deviation leads to extreme deviation... Allah knows best.. 
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Posted 28 July 2005 - 02:10 PM (#4) User is offline   Desert-Sheikh 

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Some believes of wahabiah,

They are the only Muslims; others who are against them all are blasphemous. All Sunni Muslims (Hanafi, Shafai, Hanbali, Malaki) are blasphemous because of their wrong believes and it is Islamically lawful (halal) to shed their blood and plunder their money.

Visiting the grave of the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam, and performing the tawassul [asking Allah for goodness by a prophet] by him as shirk {refers to associating partners to Allah}.

 

"To call upon the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam, when performing tawassul by the Prophet is shirk.

 

Asking the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam, for his intercession is shirk. [Although the hadiths about the Prophet’s intercession are numerous]

 

It’s prohibited Muslims to reading Dala’il-ul-Khayrat and Qasidah Burdha Sharif, says this is blasphemy [Dala’il-ul-Khayrat and Qasidah Burdha Sharif includes saying as-Salat on the Prophet and mentioning many of the Prophet’s complete descriptions]

 

They claim to destroy the domes built on the graves of the righteous Muslims (as they demolished all the domes built on the graves of the righteous Muslims, In Makkah and Madina)

 

(Allah almighty forbid) Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam has mixed in the dust after his death.(Astaghfirullah).

 

Holy parents of the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam are non-Muslim and will remain in hell forever. (Astaghfirullah)

 

 

Hadieth about Khawarijh,

 

Hazrat Abu Immama (Radi Allahu wa Anhu) [companion of our Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam] has said {these people are Killab-Ul-Naar, they are Dogs of the Hell} he also said I listened this 7 times from My beloved Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam (Tirmazi Sharif, Ibn-e-Majja sharif).

 

And all Muslim believe that wahabis are the current Khawarijh.

 

if u know arabic

http://www.sunna.info/antiwahabies/

http://www.sunna.info/roudoud/

 

Their famous titles are Wahhabi, Najjadi, Dev Bandi, Tablighi Jamat, Sipha-e-Sahab, Jamat-e-Islami (Modoodi) and many others …. They all have the same believes with littlie alterations…….

 

 

And Qadiani’s are the 2nd version of wahabia. They follow Mirza ghulam Ahmed Qadiani Maloon who claimed to be a prophet same as the grand father of Al-Saud,   Musaylimah al-Kadhdhab{ Musaylimah al-Kadhdhab was a blasphemous man who claimed the status of prophethood for himself after the demise of Prophet Muhammad sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam. He was killed by the Muslims during the caliphate of Abu Bakr Siddiq (may Allah raise his ranks)}. Current ruler of arab known as as Saudi or Aal-e-Saud because of his grand father Ibn-e-Saud. His actual tribe is Banu Hanifah.


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Posted 28 July 2005 - 03:01 PM (#5) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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*ATTENTION*  BROTHER IRFAN RAZA KHAN  *ATTENTION* YOU MUST READ AND REPLY* ITS SERIOUSLY IMPORTANT!!!!!!

(...I am appalled at your reply)

Asalam-u-alaikum.  I am Iftikhar Hussain from Bradford, UK.

first of all, I myself am a Sunni Hanafi Brelvi. 

I am just so puzzled and very very disturbed and kinda annoyed by the message you had replied to the topic of What are the beliefs of wahabi and are qadianies and ahmadiaes the same?  I just don't understand some people.  I mean, if you yourself Bro Irfan Raza Khan are a Sunni then how have you been able to write or come up withsomething stating details that Wabio/Wahabis are considered as Muslims.  It just doesn't make sense yaar.

you see, I have heard lots of stuff on wabioism/wahabi/ahle hadith sect and have noticed what their beliefs/disbeliefs are and am totally disgusted at them.  we all understand that saying even one thing evil/corrupt about Islam, or about the Qur'an or Allah or Ahle Bayt or the Sahabas or the Ambiya (Prophets) etc that such a person becomes a kafir (disbeliever and a non-Muslim and even a munafiq (hypocrite) and would be destined for hell and you find a lot of rubbish which Wabios say about Islam and have evil beliefs then how can they be considered as Muslim.

generally speaking,  I have read up on Wabios sect and have heard tapes by Sunni movlies/scholars including by Aarfan Shah and Muhammad Ikram Rizwi (Shaheed) and by some others where they talk about the Wahabi sect and I have seen a film by Allamah Kokav uranvi sahib or something where it shows the dirty beliefs of Wahabis and how they disrespect the dignity of Nabi Paak (SAW) and claim a lie against Allah and books of Deobandi/Wahabis are clearly shown on screen/camera etc, and I have understood that like many other people that Wahabis are not true Muslims but are infidels of Islam and are a corrupt sect and are actually harming and destroying the Islam deen from within and are simply kafirs and munafiqs, then how can they be classed still as Muslim and what does it mean by that Wahabi sect is a sect within Islam ....this is confusing ....and I understand that by the end of time there will be 73 different sect each one claiming to on the sirat-ul-mustakeen and on straight path on the correct sect when only one sect will be the true sect and this one sect as we know is Ahle Sunnah W'al Jamat (Sunnis) that are the true Muslims and are the correct sect so how can Wahabis be a sect within Islam and what's that supposed to mean anyway????

how can Qadiani sect be a sect out of Islam and not a wabio sect to also be out of Islam when both are actually deviant sects and are doomed for hell?  this is where it doesn't make sense.  isn't it obvious that strong followers of Dawat-e-islami or an imam of dawat-e-islam had noted on the dawat-e-islami website that Wahabis are kafirs and what about Imam Ahmad Raza Khan - did he not fight the Wahabis sect and what do you think he believed the Wahabis to be any way - I'm sure he believed that Wahabis were kafirs and were an evil and misguided sect and since this is the case, then how can true Sunnis say and claim that Wabio the bigerats and gustaakhs to be considered as Muslims, I mean are such ordinary people following their own desires and judgements and/or listening to some people who tell them that Wahabis and Deobandis are Muslims???

how can wabios still be considered as Muslims when since I understand that True Sunni molvies/muftis/scholars will tell you that Namaz behind Wabios is not allowed and that its haram to marry them and that Wabais have disrespectful beliefs about Islam and the Prophet (SAW) etc and that Sunnis should not attend Wabios funerals or invite them to their invitations nor keep relations with them nor be friends of them nor work for them nor employ them nor listen to their so-called Islam talks etc etc because the Wabios are the gustaakhs of Islam and are infidels and are kafirs and munafiqs and probably faasiqs etc and I'm sure this is what Imam Ahmad Raza Khan has also mentioned.

I mean, what makes Wahabis still Muslims when they do not hold the true aqeedah of Islam and not having correct beliefs about Islam - will someone still be taken as  muslim? I DON'T FINK SO!!

would you not curse the Wabios who say evil things about Islam and who misguide people?  Laanat to the Wabios, Deobandies, shias, qadianis, kharijites, tableeghis, salafis etc and ............only Sunnis Rule, Big upto Sunnis!!  Sunnis the best!

you see, when it can be proven by the Qur'an and Ahadeeths and from what Ala Hazrat Imam Ahmad Raza Khan has to say about the wabis and their corrupt and evil sect that wabis are disbelievers and munafiqs and will eneter the fire of hell especially if they do not repent and come to str8 sect - THEN HOW CAN WE GO ABOUT AND SAY THAT WABIOS ARE STILL CONSIDERED AS MUSLIMS AND A SECT WITHIN ISLAM,  I mean whats the difference between Wabis and qadianis anyway - to me, there not much difference and If I can say qadianis are kafirs and out of Islam then why can I not say that wabis are kafirs and out of Islam and is an evil sect that all should beware of???!!!!

ask yourself, what corrupt and evil beliefs do wabis not have, do they not dishonour the status of the Prophet (SAW) and have evil beliefs about Islam and teach wrong and daft things to people and brainwash people??????????????????????????????

how can a evil sect who says bad things about Islam and have evil beliefs be still taken as Muslims, if thats the case that they are Muslims, then why are Sunnis fighting wabis and wouldn't wabis be the brothers of Sunnis and the why is there two different sects - how can you have 2 same Muslims of 2 different sects - one belonging to a true sect and one belonging to a deviant sect that is doomed for Hell ..............this is bezerk.

May Allah guide us. Aamee.

please reply with your comments and check out surat Tauba (the ninth Surah) and see verses 107, 108, 109 and 110 and Allah says do not enter the mosques of hypocrites, so how can we still say wabis are Muslims.

LET US NOW THINK AGAIN AND start talking properly.

from Iftikhar

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Posted 28 July 2005 - 06:52 PM (#6) User is offline   irfanrazakhan 

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"WAF ALUL KHAIRA LA ALLAKUM TUFLIHOON"

(Be engaged in doing good acts in the hope that through them you may attain to success)

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
*ATTENTION*  BROTHER IRFAN RAZA KHAN  *ATTENTION* YOU MUST READ AND REPLY* ITS SERIOUSLY IMPORTANT!!!!!!(...I am appalled at your reply).  I am Iftikhar Hussain from Bradford, UK.first of all, I myself am a Sunni Hanafi Brelvi. I am just so puzzled and very very disturbed and kinda annoyed by the message you had replied to the topic of What are the beliefs of wahabi and are qadianies and ahmadiaes the same?


Dont be puzzled my friend, i thought you may have some knowledge before launching a onslaught against a sunni? haha annoyed why would you be annoyed? do you think the beliefs of qadianis and wahabbis are the same? as i have made pretty clear wahbbi  cam be considered as teachers of qadianis aqaid perhaps you missed that bit?

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
I just don't understand some people.  I mean, if you yourself Bro Irfan Raza Khan are a Sunni then how have you been able to write or come up withsomething stating details that Wabio/Wahabis are considered as Muslims. 


Well if you can show to me and others that every wahabbi is a kafir then please be my guest.. but as far as i know such fatawas do not exist and if you doubt my aqeeda well you know what they say about suspecting a Muslim? bear in mind that many of these wahabbis are themselves confused about what they should or should not believe..


QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
It just doesn't make sense yaar.you see, I have heard lots of stuff on wabioism/wahabi/ahle hadith sect and have noticed what their beliefs/disbeliefs are and am totally disgusted at them.
 

See my freind many of these people's shaytanic writings have been edited over a period of time and to consider all those that follow them all in the same boat will be a grave msitake on our part, i think you are not the only one disgusted by wahabbi teachings and beliefs...  

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
we all understand that saying even one thing evil/corrupt about Islam, or about the Qur'an or Allah or Ahle Bayt or the Sahabas or the Ambiya (Prophets) etc that such a person becomes a kafir (disbeliever and a non-Muslim and even a munafiq (hypocrite) and would be destined for hell and you find a lot of rubbish which Wabios say about Islam and have evil beliefs then how can they be considered as Muslim.


Please if you can show me some evience that every "wahabbi" hold such beliefs, and should be considered as a kafir, i will be more then happy to accept my mistake, as i am fully aware that no such statements exists within Ahle Sunnah,... i infact can give you a email address to a brother living in jeddah who calls himself wahabi on the grounds that his parents are, other then that he wants to know and learn more about Ahle sunnah wal jamah? shall i refer to this brother of mine as a kafir?  

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
generally speaking,  I have read up on Wabios sect and have heard tapes by Sunni movlies/scholars including by Aarfan Shah and Muhammad Ikram Rizwi (Shaheed)
and by some others where they talk about the Wahabi sect and I have seen a film by Allamah Kokav uranvi sahib or something where it shows the dirty beliefs of Wahabis and how they disrespect the dignity of Nabi Paak (SAW) and claim a lie against Allah and books of Deobandi/Wahabis are clearly shown on screen/camera etc, and I have understood that like many other people that Wahabis are not true Muslims but are infidels of Islam and are a corrupt sect and are actually harming and destroying the Islam deen from within and are simply kafirs and munafiqs, then how can they be classed still as Muslim and what does it mean by that Wahabi sect is a sect within Islam ....


Hmmm i aint no ulama that i will issue my own fatwas that i should consider every wahabi a non muslim or call them kafir it would be a reflection of being very narrow minded , and especially to go against the hadith of the prophet regarding the existence of 73 sects within Islam....  no comment on the names you have mentioned arafan shah and ikram rizvi? correct me if i am wrong but arent they Deobandis? linked to sipah sahaba? because i have heard simliar names used by deobandis... You must refer to those who gustakes can be proven or if you have witnessed them making such kufrai statements simlair to their gurus then by all means we are free to slate them.. but if you cant do be very careful ... 

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
this is confusing ....and I understand that by the end of time there will be 73 different sect each one claiming to on the sirat-ul-mustakeen and on straight path on the correct sect when only one sect will be the true sect and this one sect as we know is Ahle Sunnah W'al Jamat (Sunnis) that are the true Muslims and are the correct sect so how can Wahabis be a sect within Islam and what's that supposed to mean anyway????


Why are you confused brother? havent you read up on the wahabiyya movement? Imam Tahtawi Hanafi states;

"One who departs from the path of the ulamah fiqh, from aswad al azaam will have DIRECTED himself to Hell. O Muslims! Therefore, hold fast to the path of Ahle sunnah wal Jamaah.."   

Brother the one saved sect is the group of majority and the Ahle sunnah wal jamaah is of majority please read the post in this thread to rid your confusion
Is Jahanum Forever?  


QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
how can Qadiani sect be a sect out of Islam and not a wabio sect to also be out of Islam when both are actually deviant sects and are doomed for hell?  this is where it doesn't make sense.  isn't it obvious that strong followers of Dawat-e-islami or an imam of dawat-e-islam had noted on the dawat-e-islami website that Wahabis are kafirs and what about Imam Ahmad Raza Khan - did he not fight the Wahabis sect and what do you think he believed the Wahabis to be any way -


Brother unfortunately i dont think you have read statements wholely? They do not say that ahmedis and wahabbis are same... or do they? Qadianis are declared infidels!! KAFIRS TO EVEN CONSIDER THEM A SECT WITHIN ISLAM IS KUFAR!! NOW THIS FATWA HAS BEEN ISSUED!! WE DO NOT CONSIDER THEM A SECT BUT A CULT OUTSIDE THE FOLD OF ISLAM, AND CONSIDERATION OF THEM TO BE A SECT WITHIN ISLAM IS KUFAR AND ONE MUST MAKE TAUBA!  Yes Qadianis shall forever perish in hell, but the wahabbis will be forgiven, because Allah az zawjal promised his beloved  on miraaj sharif, "BAKSH DOOGA UMMAT TERE, TERE SADQE MEIN.." (i shall forgive your ummat for your sake)  AND QADIANIS ARE NOT THE UMMAT OF THE BELOVED  THEY TAKE MIRZA MALOON AS THEIR PROPHET..


QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
I'm sure he believed that Wahabis were kafirs and were an evil and misguided sect and since this is the case, then how can true Sunnis say and claim that Wabio the bigerats and gustaakhs to be considered as Muslims, I mean are such ordinary people following their own desires and judgements and/or listening to some people who tell them that Wahabis and Deobandis are Muslims???


Is their your assumption? yes wahabis sect is misguided sect, but to call them kafir is not a matter for me, can you show me any proof that all Whabbis are "beigharaats and gustaakhs" ? what do you think a sunni would follow his own desires and whims? well i cant speak on your behalf brother, but defnitely i am not...    

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
how can wabios still be considered as Muslims when since I understand that True Sunni molvies/muftis/scholars will tell you that Namaz behind Wabios is not allowed and that its haram to marry them and that Wabais have disrespectful beliefs about Islam and the Prophet (SAW) etc and that Sunnis should not attend Wabios funerals or invite them to their invitations nor keep relations with them nor be friends of them nor work for them nor employ them nor listen to their so-called Islam talks etc etc because the Wabios are the gustaakhs of Islam and are infidels and are kafirs and munafiqs and probably faasiqs etc and I'm sure this is what Imam Ahmad Raza Khan has also mentioned.I mean, what makes Wahabis still Muslims when they do not hold the true aqeedah of Islam and not having correct beliefs about Islam - will someone still be taken as  muslim? I DON'T FINK SO!!


Indeed namaz and others you have mentioned is true, but it seems, no imam ahmed raza khan  does not classify all wahabis as infidels, please go and study a bit further, before making some of the invalid points you are making  also you seem to be drifting away from the concerned topic, please do try and stick to topic...

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
would you not curse the Wabios who say evil things about Islam and who misguide people? Laanat to the Wabios, Deobandies, shias, qadianis, kharijites, tableeghis, salafis etc and ............only Sunnis Rule, Big upto Sunnis!!


Hmm seeing your stance, no i would rather prefer to follow the sunnah of my beloved  and make dua to Allah for their guidance as well as yours and mine.. Ameen it clear you consider qadianis to be a sect within islam? bro they are decalred non muslims please do not put them along side the sects that are within islam as your confusion will cause confusion to other people!

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
 will eneter the fire of hell especially if they do not repent and come to str8 sect - THEN HOW CAN WE GO ABOUT AND SAY THAT WABIOS ARE STILL CONSIDERED AS MUSLIMS AND A SECT WITHIN ISLAM,  I mean whats the difference between Wabis and qadianis anyway


Perhaps a bit of your research for your imaan will do you a big favour?  

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
- to me, there not much difference and If I can say qadianis are kafirs and out of Islam then why can I not say that wabis are kafirs and out of Islam and is an evil sect that all should beware of???!!!!


Because there is no fatawa stateing that ALL Wahabbis should be considered to be out of the fold of Islam or should be refered to as kafirs...
 
You see the thing is do you know the mercy of our beloved    can you measure it? have forgotten the love he   has for those that claim to be his ummat?

 Where as their is a fatawa which declares ALL qadianis (followers of mirza) who consider mirza as their prophet, to be out of the fold of Islam.. You are free to call whom what you like as every body has a right to their opnions, but i certainly dont induldge in such...
 The wahabbis call us qabar pujaris and infidels etc you tell me is there any truth to it? those that refer to us as infidels let their be no doubt in such people's cases they are murtads, and we are free to call them what we like, but to put all Wahabis on same boat and sink it, doesnt help, the fatawas where issued against inviduals who murmerred such filth and not against wahabii brothers that use our forums such as aamir khan etc when the teachings of their gurus are unveiled many of them leave the path they are following blindly? or if someone can show me where we must refer to them all as infidels?  

we should be effectively trying to give the message of love which islam teaches, and not throwing back at them their own doctrines of saying "oh you are kafir oh you are murtad" instead we should say to them we make dua to Allah for your guidance from the deviation upon which they are... Simliarly the dua for Qadianis would be that may Allah guide them to Islam.. Ameen      
 

QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
ask yourself, what corrupt and evil beliefs do wabis not have, do they not dishonour the status of the Prophet (SAW) and have evil beliefs about Islam and teach wrong and daft things to people and brainwash people??????????????????????????????how can a evil sect who says bad things about Islam and have evil beliefs be still taken as Muslims, if thats the case that they are Muslims, then why are Sunnis fighting wabis and wouldn't wabis be the brothers of Sunnis and the why is there two different sects - how can you have 2 same Muslims of 2 different sects - one belonging to a true sect and one belonging to a deviant sect that is doomed for Hell ..............this is bezerk.


Why don't you ask yourself why should we consider all wahabiis the same as their blasphemous leaders? why should we think  that every  wahabbi is brainwashing innocent people? isnt the writer of the book of 'kitaab ut tawheed' to blame? or do we blame the wahabbi who doesnt know what truth is because he is never presented it? and the people who are suppose to present it are the same as the the clowns he is forced into following for various reasons? who call every  MUSLIM A KAFIR? 

Sunni ulamas are fighting against the wahabbi ulamas who brainwash other unweary people, infact these scholars of the wahabiiya have infact brainwashed themselves! so if we act like them and start calling everyone kafir will this help anyone? The ulamas have been fighting against their scholars and leaders and not inviduals who are misguided into following the devaint ways that are presented to them by using various means, by exploiting meanings of tawheed, and taking other Muslims to be setting partners with Allah (MAZALLAH)

"surat Tauba (the ninth Surah) and see verses 107, 108, 109 and 110 and Allah says do not enter the mosques of hypocrites, so how can we still say wabis are Muslims."

Then why are the saudi wahabbis in charge of Mecca tul mukrama and Madina sharif surely these are the biggest and most valued masajid for Muslims, please i do urge you read the tafsir's before trying to create some what contradictions from the holy Quraan sharif...


May Allah guide the misguideds.. Ameeen

Barakalafeekum

please do forgive this sinful brother if i have uttered something wrong... try and understand my intial post it wont shock you as much as it has, for it is only stateing truth...


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Posted 29 July 2005 - 02:34 PM (#7) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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from Iftikhar Hussain.         SUNNIS RULE!     SUNNIS THE BEST!!    BIG UP TO SUNNIS!!

Insha Allah, I will try to reply but I just wana check out the Yanabi site for a moment.  thanks for your email anyway as there as somethings I have to read, check and think about again after looking at what you had stated.

the thing is I truely have had not the intention in hurting you in any way but just wanted some answers/comments/informations from yourself about your reply to the previous questioner and the wabi and qadiani stuff.

wen I stated 'I am confused or this is confusing or summat' ...these are the parts/areas where I need to look proerly into yet and gain some further guidance/knowledge.

in the mean time, tayk cair. and where are you from any way bro?
but kwickly, see down:
P.S Would you agree that Shias and all Shias are Kafirs and munafiqs or do you feel/think that there aint a fatwa that would say that all Shias are kafirs (disbelievers/non-Muslims)?  and do you agree that those who have astrayed from the path of Ahle Sunnah W'al Jamat such as the Wabis and deobandies are no longer true Muslims but are munafiqs and that the leaders of such corrupt sects are and were only but kafirs and hypocrites and that those who follow them whether knowingly or unknowingly that such followers of corrupt sect are also the same as their leaders that is 'KAFIRS ' and munafiqs and will only enter hell because if their corrupt leaders died as disbelievers and destined for hell then what about those who also spend their life following their evil teachings whether knowing or not and how come such disbelievers be entered into paradise when Jannat is only made for the believers that is for the true Muslims who are on the Haq?

what about the one sect only entering jannah while others going to fire of Hell, so since Sunni sect is the correct sect and will Insha Allah enter paradise and that we hold the belief that Sunni sect is true while Wabi sect for instance is evil and they will go to Hell fire especially if they do not repent then how can a true Sunni Muslim beliver say or assume Wabis to be Muslims? I mean, would that be like saying that Wabis are on the correct sect and on sirat-ul-mustakeen.  if that wud hav been the case, then why would there be trouble between 2 sects and how can 2 sect be true sects on the sirat-e-mustakeen but we understand only 1 sect is true and will enter jannah, so where will the other go.  its clear that other sects are not true sects and for them is the fire of hell and for Ahle Sunnah W'al Jamat is th Paradise, Insha Allah.

do reply.  by the way, my email address is: hb014g4573@hotmail.co.uk

I eagerly luk fwd 2 hearin from u.
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Posted 29 July 2005 - 02:34 PM (#8) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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from Iftikhar.  can sum1 plz tell me what is meant by 'narrow-minded' or sumat'. fank u

to irfan raza Khan, besides Muslims(Sunnis) are Muslims (Sunnis) in other words they are true believers so is it not true that only one sect is the one with true believers and aren't then wabis not the false believers i.e. dis-believers then why do we need to go round and round jump up and down and get hold of any wabio off the street for egg-zample and ask them if he truely is a wabi or if he has said anyfing evil about the Prophet (saw) or what corrupt beiefs he or she holds because end of day Wabis are Wabis?

another thing is that how are Wabis also the ummats of the Holy Prophet (SAW) 'cos I thought only Sunnis were the ummats of the Prophet (SAW) as ummats of the Prophet are those who are believers and believers are those who are true Muslims and this in turn are those who are Sunnis ........isn't that the case.   so please help me more on this ummat side of story.  I'm really bothered about such issues so I need urgent assistance/help on such brief issues.  and also what is the difference between Ummat (nation) and firak (sect) as well as the true firak (sect)??

Also what does the word Tafsir mean in english? please explain

please reply.  you can also email me on hb014g4573@hotmail.co.uk

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Posted 29 July 2005 - 03:17 PM (#9) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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to Irfan Raza Khan, out of interest and if you don't mind, are you also Sunni Hanafi Brelvi?

please let me know.

from Iftikhar
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Posted 29 July 2005 - 03:34 PM (#10) User is offline   Secular-Revolution 

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Brother Iftikhar Hussain,

Assalam Alaikum,

Brother Irfan's reply was in line with the aqeedah of the Ahl-e-Sunnat Wal Jamaah.

If you claim to be sunni hanafi barelwi then can you advise of of a fatwa of Ala Hazrat (RA) which states that the Wahabis are kafir?

If you believe so then may I give you a shell shock. The pious and holy lands of Makkah and Madinah Shareef and swarming with kafirs. (Naazubillah).

Having the wrong aqeedah doesn't necessarily make one a disbeliever. If you are not sure of the principles of Islam, just ask before you embark on attacking someone.



Kaabay Kis Mun Se Jao Ge SR!
Sharam Tum Ko Magar Nahin Aati

The difference between the Mullah and Satan is that the latter is not a hypocrite!
[Secular Revolution - the artist formerly known as Sunni Revolution]
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Posted 29 July 2005 - 05:08 PM (#11) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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from Iftikhar.  Brother, what does Shell shock mean and what does Tafsir mean in english?
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Posted 29 July 2005 - 05:27 PM (#12) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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I need some help on this because I think its a bit confusing here. 

you see, brother Irfan Raza Khan has mentioned that wahabis are as you can say the senior teachers of qadianism and that qadianis are at all costs the Non-Muslims and a sect out of Islam and so the thing I don't understand here is that if Wahabis are the senior teachers or teachers-like of qadianism and that qadianis are out Islam, then how come Wahabis aren't, I mean wouldn't that mean that Wahabism sect is or their corrupt teachings are worse than qadianism because I have heard by Sunni Malana saying that Wahabism are worse than qadianism because for example, the qadianis claim that Hazrat Isa (AS) has died and not living while Wahabis say that Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) is died and not living (in other words 'murdah') (Allah Taubah) so this is where I don't understand some things where if qadianis are totally kafirs and a sect not belonging to Islam then what makes Wahabism sect still fitted in the sect of Islam and this is where some confusions come up and also are there any books by sunni scholars that someone can suggest we could or should approach?  and once again, can some people stop claiming that I am coming out with onslaught or attacking some brothers or some person when I am not because otherwise why am I keep on replying - somply to ask for advice and information/answers that could help some probably misunderstood Muslims.

I hope there will be some understanding.

please reply.  also my email is: hb014g4573@hotmail.co.uk.

basically, if its true that Ala Hazrat has not claimed wahabis or all wahabis to be Kafirs, then all you have to or someone has to say and reply is that 'Ala Hazrat has or has not said such and such a thing' instead of hitting it to me in a manner like 'where does it say or prove and all that kinda stuff'.  because the idea is to listen and share our knowledge and understanding basically.  I hope you agree.  and once again, I am not attacking anyone but asking for help and we should all be helping.
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Posted 29 July 2005 - 05:42 PM (#13) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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1. can some one tell me that if it is not allowed for Sunnis to read salaah behind wahabis, then is it not because Wahabis or wahabi so-called molvies/Imams are dis-believers and if they are not disbelievers and hypocrites (munafiqs) then what are they?, because either a person is a believer or a disbeliever and once again I aint attacking no 1 and I'm sure you all agree that I aint attacking no1 but asking for support and information and I am not trying to be funny, thats true.

2. let some one ask themself that if they are not allowed to read namaz behind other than Sunni Imams and that salaah being a wahabi will not be accepted, then why it it so, I mean is the wahabi so-called molvie/imam not a person who is out of Islam and if he is still considered as a Muslim, then why will Salaah not be allowed behind them and will salaah not be accepted behind them?

Normally, I believe (as I've heard and read up in books) that Salaah behind Wahabis is not allowed nor accepted and am I not right in this issue? please tell me

3. also tell me what should a Sunni do if they go for umrah or hajj and if there is no Sunni Imam to lead the prayer but thereis only a wahabi leading the prayer, what should or what are we ordered to do, I mean do we read separatly or what do we do?

4.  Are we supposed to stay away from Hizb Ut Tahir also and who are they any way and are they some kind of deviance or somethingas I've read ina book probably written by Sajid-ul-Hashmi?

I await for your jawaab.  shuria


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Posted 30 July 2005 - 01:05 PM (#14) User is offline   Desert-Sheikh 

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QUOTEOriginally posted by: IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN
1. can some one tell me that if it is not allowed for Sunnis to read salaah behind wahabis, then is it not because Wahabis or wahabi so-called molvies/Imams are dis-believers and if they are not disbelievers and hypocrites (munafiqs) then what are they?,


Assalam o Alaikum,
Dear brother IFTIKHAR HUSSAIN

Don’t be confuse, everything is clear.

 

Ilive in Jeddah and i see a lot of people around me, who known as wahhabi but they don’t know the beliefs of wahhabiah. One of my colleague who is Saudi and sometimes insists me to be Ghair Muqqalid(stupid). It means how deeply he is involved in wahhabiism. But when I told him the comments of wahhabia of indo-o-pak about the Best Creation of Allah Almighty (Salalalhu Aliah wassalam), he surprised and said “ how can they be muslim?”

I told him that your own people have the same beliefs, but he refused. He said” Lahaula wala Quwata Illa Billah”. But he is still wahhabi, he doesn’t want to follow any Imam, he doesn’t want to celebrate Millad Sharif and …..

 

Listen bro; these are the common people in Saudi Arabia and they are not Kafir, of course not. They are deceived by their own scholars, because they only see them, listen them. When they'll listen the TRUTh, Insha'Allah Azzawajal, they'll accept it. now blind mufti is all in all..........

I forward some books of our grand Imam Ala’ Hazrat radi allahu Ta’al Anhu, to some sunni and non-suni arabs and both replied he is a great scholar. I’m giving them one by one … at the end Insha’Allah Almight I’ll give them Hassam ul Haramin.

 

The book about knowledge of unseen “ Aldoola tul Makkiyah”, I gave to an imam Masjid in Jeddah and he said “ Alhadmulillah Azzawajal, I’ve the same believe” Alhadmulillah Azzawajal.

 

All Arab, even all Saudis are not wahhabis, if some of them are wahhabis, than all wahabis aren’t Kafirs.

We don’t follow them in prayers because they are misguided people, but if anyone of them having the wrong beliefs that are declared by our Ulama, he is 100 % Kafir and there is no doubt.

Only in Jeddah there are 2 Sunni Imam Masjid, Alhamdulillah Azzawajal. And I offer Jummah’s prayer behind them. Alhadmulillah Azzawajal.

During hajj & Ummrah it isn’t necessary to pray behind an imam, you can pray alone or your own Jama’t if you are two or more…..

Wassalam Ma'al Ikram


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Posted 30 July 2005 - 02:33 PM (#15) User is offline   shahban-aziz 

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Assalamualaikum brother Naveed,

A great post showing your love for Ahle Sunnah and InshAllah soon those who have been misguided will be bought to the straight path.  Keep up your good work and we alwalys pray for people to follow the Haq and see the light.

Ameen,

Shahban
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Posted 02 August 2005 - 09:07 PM (#16) User is offline   LuayBehzad 

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Would it be surprising to know that much of the earliest Qadyanis were wahabis infact (ahle hadees).

It seems funny, but it is true, the connections between the Qadyanis and the Wahabis run deep.

Both seem to have a grudge against the blessed Mawlid.

Lu'ay
Service to mankind

Ya RasulAllah al Madad
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Posted 05 August 2005 - 05:20 PM (#17) User is offline   hb014g4573 

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I never knew that that earliest Qadianis were wahabis.  please can you explain more for our understanding.

thumbs up for Sunnis      and thumbs down for wabios.

thanks.  from Iftikhar Hussain. 


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Posted 06 October 2005 - 10:23 AM (#18) User is offline   Naj_1988 

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786
All grace be to Allah he who made man with different likenings and may his blessings and mercy be upon his Beloved Prophet Saw and His Companions and Whoever conjoined and espoused them to the day of resurrection.

Salam.
I would just to like to make a few matters clear, though this may seem to some that Wahabi's are Ghustaakhi-Rasool Saw as a matter of fact not all of them are.Seeing as we have become blind followers of whatever we see & hear it may seem to us now that conjoining and espousing Wahabbi's aka Deobandi's is unimaginable. I myself tend to go to a Brelwi mosque even though the wahhabi mosques are not distant from me.But I also happen to go to the Wahhabi mosque as to avoid trivial and frivolous divisions between the Ummah.
My point is go to there mosques and talk to them i dont me quarrell with them because quarelling at this time is all in vain.
My first question is what is the simialrity betwwen wahabi's and deobandis.
Wahabism was established about 250 years ago by abdullah bin wahaab wheras  deobandism was established more or less when brelwism was established. so whats is the simalarity betwwen the two?

Yours Awating
Rahmani
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Posted 08 October 2005 - 10:56 AM (#19) User is offline   Padree 

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Posted 08 October 2005 - 11:22 AM (#20) User is offline   rehansayyed 

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Have you ever learned about islam. have you heared some islamic literatures or read. This is my geniune question to help you as it seems you have just opened you eyes.

If yes then i think you are one of them and dont have any answer of the proof given above and you dont want accept the reality which bites and you dont want to improve by doing tauba. There is better option tauba.

AAJ LE UNKI PANAH AAJ MADAD MANG UNSE
PHIR NA MANGE QAYAMAT ME AGAR MAN GAYA



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