www.sunnipath.com
main page image main page image
The Global Islamic Community
Home       Members    Calendar    Who's On
Welcome Guest ( Login | Register )
        


«««12345»»»

www.sunnipath.com Expand / Collapse
Author
Message
Posted 22.01.2004 11:35:59


Full Moon

Full Moon

Group: Administrators
Last Login: Today @ 17:01:30
Posts: 5 095, Visits: 2 908
Yes I agree with brother Abdul Mustafa and Shah Sahib;

Many of our 'scholars' are not technically scholars, there are many masail / issues of Fiqh, arabic grammer etc which they dont know - the standard is dropping particularly in the younger generation, however I would say its not like the deobandi's are all massive scholars in all areas, like the brother said they are sly and sneaky and do get in the the active positions which may make them look like big scholars.

If you compare our top Ulema - or what I would call our Ulema, they are more knowledglable then there ulema; im not just saying this but im saying it from a practical view which I have seen.

It is also important that when discussing this we dont include those Ulema that have gone to the extent to become propper scholars and have completed the full 8 year Dars-e-Nizami course and beyond.

It is for this reason I only take from a few scholars in this country as their information is relaible, correct and authentic.



ei biradar chu 'aqibat khakast, khaak shawesh az ankei khaak shawee
 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3049
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 22.01.2004 15:03:08


Waxing Gibbous

Waxing Gibbous

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 15.03.2005 14:32:49
Posts: 1 367, Visits: 0
as salam 'alaikum Biradaram Aqae 'Abdul Mustafaii, kheli Khoobam, tashakkur

I am delighted to read your mail, and I feel guilty of something that I cannot disclose to yu Baradar, I did not know that Sidi Faraz Rabbani has been trying to get our Barelwi scholars from India and Pakistan. It is so saddening, unfortunate, inna lillah.

Recently, there was a question on the site www.sunnipath.com about a person saying that his parents want him to go to Pakistan to study islam under the Hanafi scholars there and he said that he fears that he might loose if he does not go to the scholars in the 'arab world.

The question was assigned to the same deobandi scholar (Ibn Adam al Kawthari of www.darulitfa.org)  there who I mentioned to have changed into more of a kind of a barelwi than a deobandi. Then he started answering the above person's mail and started telling him how the arab scholars have praised the GREAT scholars of the Indo-Paki subcontinent, but the interesting point is ALL of the scholars he mentions, who the BIG arab Hanafi scholars such as Sheikh Abu Ghudda rahimullah, Sheikh Alawi al Maliki, Sheikh Zahid al Kawthari rahimullah he says have praised, are DEOBANDIS.

In the whole question only deobandi scholars are mentioned, and so he advises the person above to go to these contemporary Hanafi (to us deobandi) scholars in Karachi and Lahore to study deen, no mention of barelwi scholars at all, WHAT A BIAS!!!!!!!!!!!

All the arab students and followers of tasawwuf in their hundreds may be thousands will come to this site and read this answer by the above deobandi scholar, they will unfornutately think the deobandis are the Hanafi scholars of India, infact they wont even know the scholars they would be studying under are deobandi, what a deception!!!!!

Unfortunately yu and I can predict what will happen to these people in the future, I mean who dont know the deobandi barelwi issue and have read these answers by the hidden deobandi scholars on www.sunnipath.com, and so will come to think great of the mentioned Hanafi scholars (deobandis).

The predictions are these,

When these arabs and others will come to Pakistan they will be taken straight to the great Hanafi institutions there (deobandi to us)
and then they will be given the knowledge of islam (though not the deobandi poisoning initiallly)
and when they come to respect the scholars there immensely, and get ijazas from them, they would then become diehard defenders of them and so may then fight all those people who go against their teachers.


They will then in that stage become engrained in the barelwi issue and ophcourse they will give the same old baseless dunya-oriented fatwas of deobandism against us the sufis of india-the barelwis.

However, there would be a many exceptions in them, people who are intelligent who might come to know on the way the heretical, dunya-oriented approach of these deobandis.

Please if yu want to add something, certainly do.

Subhanallah, what more can I say but that I should ask a few questions myself on that site!!



Ya Abu Bakar...Ya 'Umar.....Ya 'Uthman....Ya 'Ali


as salam 'alaykom wa rehmatuAllahi wa barakatuHu

 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3052
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 23.01.2004 04:20:10


New Moon

New Moon

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 10.02.2009 23:20:15
Posts: 91, Visits: 2
wa alaykum as-salam Ali agha! shoma baayad ba man email bakonii...:-) ( email-am asifjuk@yahoo.co.uk ast)

**
You are right. I know of that answer which Kawthari sahib gave which you mention--a brother emailed it to me-and that is what has made me so depressed. Since Ala Hazrat it seems our ulama--those we consider great included!--have for the most part done very little WRITTEN work. Yet we give them all these big titles!! We have disgraced the work of and name of Ala Hazrat, our beloved Imam! Do you think he is happy with his followers?! All our ulama do is give talks to their own select bands of followers and bask in their mureeds' praise. I include the top (or so called top) ulama in this too. The only Sunni ulama in the UK who seem to be doing anything constructive vis-a-vis written work/tarbiyya of the youth are Pirzada Imdad Hussain Sahib and the sons of Shaykh Allamah Abdul Wahab Siddiqui and to a certain extent the Sultan Bahu Trust (at least they are trying to make links with Arab Sunnis). The rest of our ulama/shuyukh still behave as if they are in India/Pakistan at the beginning of the 20th century and apart from harping on about the same old contentious issues with deobandits don't do anything. And to top it off is the vicious in fighting amongst the different Sunni organisations and bad mouthing of each others pirs! You even see it on this forum! Yes, teaching the correct aqidah is important but there is a way of doing it. Making sarcastic remarks about what Deobandis' few scholars like Thanawi et al said 100 years ago is not it! It gets boring after a while and more importantly people get put off and go elsewhere.

Why do you think people like Shaykh Nuh, Hamza Yusuf, Abdul Hakim Murad and Sayyid Habib Ali al Jifri and Sayyid Yaqubi are so popular? They actually TEACH Sunni aqidah instead of spending all their time attacking others!

I am sure there are great ulama of Ahle Sunnat in Indo-Pak but we need to be organised and promote them and they too need to become more modern in their organisation. This means an emphasis on written work and more written work and specialising in Arabic to reach out to the Arab Sunnis;also using the web for promoting themselves. Dar ul Ulum Deoband has a professional website. No Sunni madrassah has anything like a decent
website! What's up with us?  Why dont Jamia Rizvia and Jamia Ashrafiyya have such websites?

In the UK we are light years behind the Deobandis in every aspect. Their single madrassah in Bury produces more alims than all the Sunni mosques in the country put together! The only ones we have are Jamia al Karam and Hijaz College and they too always struggle due to lack of funding/support from other Sunnis (I think due to jealousy) and have only produced a handful of basic alims. But I commend them for their sincere efforts. At least its something...

I am sure these 2 organisations will do well in the future. I am depressed at our state and want to cry...

Aah aah! az zaf i Islam aah aah!







Dar tha ke 'isyaaN kii sazaa ab hogi ke roz i jazaa

Dee Unkii rahmat ne sadaa 'yeh bhi nahin voh bhi nahin!'

--Ala Hazrat

 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3063
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 23.01.2004 11:17:52


New Moon

New Moon

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 22.05.2009 23:36:29
Posts: 40, Visits: 14

Salaams
Brother i couldn't have put it better myself.  Indeed the situation makes one cry.  The most simple facts of the matter are that unless our Ahle-Sunnah ulema can converse with the masses in an organised, united, non-elitist manner and in the English language, more and more people will go to persons who can give them this.

PS.. the link to the email in question above is http://www.sunnipath.com/Resources/Questions/QA00003154.aspx">http://www.sunnipath.com/Resources/Questions/QA00003154.aspx">http://www.sunnipath.com/Resources/Questions/QA00003154.aspx

Just on a personal note i find it very difficult to understand how many of the Ind-Pak Hafiz-e-Qur'an in this country can memorise the Qur'an by the grace of Allah (swt) but find it so difficult to learn some English.  Surely, it can't be difficult for them, having been graced with such memories.

Anyway enough of the moan.......let's pray for a brighter future.
Wa'salaams
KM



 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3070
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 23.01.2004 15:19:08


Waxing Gibbous

Waxing Gibbous

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 15.03.2005 14:32:49
Posts: 1 367, Visits: 0

as salam 'alaikum Aqae 'Abdul Mustafii, khelii tashakkur!!!!!!!!!

You mentioned baradar about the fiscious inter fighting between the barelwi 'ulama, I have seen it, its also all here in this forum, as yu say.
Being an Iranian and outsider, I am surprised the way people talk to eachother and judging each other, and as Sheikh Nuh tells me it reflects their shuyukh immensely.

Whatever one does as a mureed, it reflects most of the times what he has been taught by his Sheikh, this is what Sheikh Nuh told me. He also said that when tasawwuf becomes a story only, in other words, just an oral tradition of passing down stories of the pious, then it is dead.

He says we do need the stories of what our awliyah did, but we need to do less of talking and more of tazkiyah.
Tazkiyah when done goes into a circle, yu will be surprised to see what is in this circle







  • Tazkiyatu Nafs .......leads to


  • Muhasaba and mashwara ...which leads to


  • GAINING 'ILM (knowledge)........which then leads to (this involves all the islamic sciences)


  • Tawbah ....which then goes up to tazkiyah again


'Ala Hadrat by knowing his books and written works is a Master of the Sunni creed. He is one of the stars to me.

You see Murabit al Hajj hafizuhullah, he is an old small man sitting in the desert in some deep corner of Mauritania, with only one pair of sky blue thowbs on his body, sitting on a twig bed under a twig shade. He has spent his life like that. If yu go with Sheikh Hamzah Yusuf (his mureed) to see him, yu will say that this person is certainly a faqeer, he has nothing there and yu might want to just ignore him. But before yu do that yu must know that he is among the most learned men on earth!!, a hafiz of Qur'an, all of hadith, all of fiqh, master of tasawwuf, master of arabic, such and such that Habibi Ali Jifri could not help it but hold his feet with his bare hands and cry.

Brother, Habibi Ali Zain Al 'Abidin Al Jifri ( a direct descendent of our Nabi saws from Imam Hussain radiallahu 'anh) then came out of the place and said, that he knew Yemen is the land of hikmah, as he is yemeni himself, and also of zuhud as a consequence of that hikmah, but compared to the zuhud of the murabitun somewhere in the sahara desert, it is nothing.

There are hundreds there in the madrassah of this faqeer in the Kavir of mauritania, and believe me they never quarrel among eachother, they are so nice, such excellent manners, it truly shows who their sheikh is. They are all doing zikar all the time. I havent seen such nice people in my life.

What are these students studying there? the sciences of islam under Murabit ul Hajj. They are becoming 'aalims in fiqh, Sarf, Nawh, Balagha, Mantiq, tafseer, hadith, Qiraat, Khattati, Tasawwuf, even poetry and prophetic medicine.

The school is not a buliding. It is spread in the desert as a bunch of some tens of tents, under which they study, while they are surrounded by fresh green desert shrubs, a miracle of Allah subhanahuu. Their toilet is the desert and their water is a well.

What have I done even by now, I have also been sucked into the fighting here on this site, to which I have been trying to amend,

Habib 'Umar says the closest to Allah is the one with the best adab.

I have lived with deobandis, in the UK, here in Toronto Canada, in Afghanistan and so on, you could say 99% of them are united against barelwis. They do not fight among themselves and they claim to follow tasawwuf all the time, to which I disagree. I have seen so many speeches of these scholars while sitting next to them, they include the latest person Dr Zulfiqar Ahmed, but what I saw they do not interfight, though this cannot be generalized. I know salafi interfighting, but at the moment in saudi arabia, they are all united under the banner of oil money. I have lived in saudi for more than 10 years with them and know them very well.

Once Sheikh al Akbar Ibn al 'arabi radiallahu 'anh had a small very tiny tiny argument of some kind with Abu Madyan radiallahu 'anhu, one of the Qutub of Allah here on earth and then Sheikh al Akbar had a dream in which our Habibullah saws ordered him to agree to what Abu Madyan has said to him, and he did it in the morning, when Abu Madyan radiallahu anhu inquired as to why he did it, Sheikh al Akbar replied because I was ordered by Nabiallah saws. Abu Madyan cried and apologized to his mureed Sheikh al Akbar and everyone around them were in awe and couldnt believe it.

Imam al Haddad radiallahu 'anhu says that even the smallest bad deed is multiplied innumerable times once it reaches yu in the heavens on the day of judgement, so be ware, this is so terrifying.


You see, if your adab is not right, if yu are an attacker, insulter, then where is the tasawwuf in you?
You can prove all your opponents wrong in engaging them in debates what after that, are yu satisfied? Could yu have proved your opponents wrong in some other way?

When one calls oneself as Qadiri or Naqshbandi or Chishti or whatever, it means he belongs to the tareeqa, it means he follows tasawwuf.
Now Tasawwuf demands yu do not fight with your brother, yu do not break yourselves in sects, or groups that envy eachother.

The above are nothing but the basic islamic good habits and have not even touched the surface of the field of tasawwuf. If our scholars dont even do them, then how can they claim to know the secret of our Nabi salalaho 'alaihi wa aalihi preserved in the noble tareeqas i have mentioned above.

Tasawwuf is practical not oral, it is the foundation of 'Ala Hadrat's followers. The shi'a have nothing in them, yu seem them interfighting all the time, since I an Iranian know this, as I have seen it in Iran, Saudia, Iraq and Lebanon and Bahrain.

Did Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani try to hurt anyone?
Did he ever insult his opponents?

5000 jews and christians in Baghdad al Shareef accepted islam on his hand by just looking at him, his adab, his kindness.
They saw how their priests and rabbis hated muslims and islam, but they saw how this Wali of Allah loved everyone and hated all that was evil.
So many shi'a in 'Iraq left their evil ways and became the mureeds and sunni under Ghawth al 'Adham. That now the former shi'a area of Karkh is nothing but a sunni area.

The deobandis make their madrassahs for dunya. Their scholars are dunya people, it is general. They like money.
We still dont have such kinds of madrassahs, so if we start now and make them for the ilm of TASAWWUF and islam they will surpass all, that is the real revival of us. You mentioned two madrassahs in the UK and some in the subcontinent that made me so happy, inshallah I will pray more for them.

Imam Ghazali radiallahu anh says that all the ilm yu get in madrassahs is still dunyavi 'ilm. The 'ilm of akhira is 'ilm al Tasawwuf.
If one does insulting, backbiting (so much on this site against ones own sunnis,deobandi scholars, wahabi scholars, even by me against shi'a), nameema (bad talk that one dislikes face to face), pride (like of being a syed), or ones bullies others and wants to subjugates others, fights, ARGUES, one does not follow  even the basic adab then how does one claim to follow tasawwuf then? Why should one then claim to be Qadiri, Naqshbandi, Tijani etc. I saw Tijanis in detroit backbiting their opponets, I asked them dont yu want to give them a chance to defend themselves and I asked them about whether backbiting is in TASAWWUF?

Winning over deobandis and every sect of shias (9 today) by arguments, attacks, fights, insults, or proving them wrong is not winning for sunniyat. 
Once a deobandi insulted me, he said yu barelwis are ignorant, I did not even know what barelwi meant at that time since I was only 15 in Saudi. I asked him why ignorant? he said all your 'ulama do is spend their lives proving others, among themselves or outside, as wrong while our 'ulama write books and study. I did not know what he meant. Now i understand everything.





Ya Abu Bakar...Ya 'Umar.....Ya 'Uthman....Ya 'Ali


as salam 'alaykom wa rehmatuAllahi wa barakatuHu

 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3073
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 24.01.2004 14:32:14


New Moon

New Moon

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 08.03.2004 20:56:17
Posts: 12, Visits: 0
Mashallah!! We are at last heading in the right direction towards a united Sunni front. Propagating by example was and is how we can and will achieve our goal of spreading peace and harmony to the world at large. If not, then you can see the results before you! I frequently say to colleagues and family members that even if an atomic bomb were to land on us today, that we would still deny that we had been hit, so busy are we in our fractious infighting and decline in our intellectual capabilities, to the extent that Almighty Allah SWT has put a veil in front of our eyes, the veil of lethargy, self-conceit, arrogance, gheebat and an intolerance of any other kind of Sunnism!!

Sunnism is for the whole world, NOT just Indo-Pak Subcontinent---just look at the books of the Savants of Ahle Sunnat Wal Jama'at from Scholars all over the world, not just Mauritania, Yemen, Syria, Egypt or India/Pakistan!!

No one owns Sunnism, keep your heroes whether they be Aala Hazrat, Imaam Ghazaali, Maulana Rumi, Daata Lahori Saahib, Kwaaja Ajmeri Saahib, Hazrat Ghous ul Azaam, Sheikh Nuh, Sheikh Nazim al Haqqani, Maulana Shah Ahmed Noorani, Professor Tahir ul Qadri, Maulana Ilyas Qadri, Pir Abdul Qadir Jilaani (of Markazi Jama'at Ahle Sunnat), Sheikh Hamza Yousuf, Sheikh Hakim Murad or who whoever else (May Allah be pleased with them all), BUT PLEASE DON'T speak ill of others!! Your judgement is your's to keep, NOT to thrust into any other person . Follow your spiritual guides and live like the true Savants of the past and of today. Let ISHQ-e-RASOOL, ISHQ-e-SAHAABA, ISHQ--AHLE BAYT and ISHQ-e-AULIA ALLAH be your distinguishing feature and the criterion to judge!!

I am hopeful that as our cries of SUNNI UNITY are heard by our Creator SWT and His Beloved Habeeb SAW, then the RENAISSANCE is not far!! If we fail to heed this, then we will surely perish, as our internal/external enemies would wish, as past and present nations have/are realising to their costs!! LOOK IN THE MIRROR LONG AND HARD AND YOU WILL FIND YOUR WORST ENEMY!!! Indeed it is worth crying about!! But Islam teaches positiveness, so let's turn over a new leaf in our book of woes and look forward as the brother formerly mentioned!!

Let's not kid ourselves and start to live Sunni Islam as taught by our Great Savants and keep with good company, then we will not need to worry about the 'OTHERS'

We should become supporters/fans of and design and wear tea shirts/caps/jumpers with the slogan ''SUNNIS UNITED''!! WHAT D'YA SAY!!

ALLAH HAAFIZ.


 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3087
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 24.01.2004 21:40:44


Waxing Gibbous

Waxing Gibbous

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Today @ 18:39:53
Posts: 1 708, Visits: 1 324
Please inform me of where does the UNITY exists in our Ahle Sunnah today ? In which town city district and country ? We can only dream about unity as long as there are BAD ULAMAS in amongst us ...


Ali (as) e Imam e manasto manum ghulaam e Ali (as)
 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3091
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 24.01.2004 21:48:04


Waxing Gibbous

Waxing Gibbous

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 15.03.2005 14:32:49
Posts: 1 367, Visits: 0
as salam 'alaikum dear brother,

Mashallah what a great reply, mashallah mashallah

Let the pessimistic people stuck in constant fighting and debate to prove themselves right be in their misery. Sunni unity will remove all barriers, the mischeivours will them go down. inshallah. Sunni unity must be made a realtiy, it is emerging, yes we are on the path of unity, but there are still people stuck in the fighting who want us to get stuck into it too, but that is to no avail.

mashallah brother for such a nice reply

shukar jazeelan



Ya Abu Bakar...Ya 'Umar.....Ya 'Uthman....Ya 'Ali


as salam 'alaykom wa rehmatuAllahi wa barakatuHu

 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3092
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 24.01.2004 23:07:41


New Moon

New Moon

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 08.03.2004 20:56:17
Posts: 12, Visits: 0
As- salaamu Alaykum!

According to many Ahadeeth, 'Bad Ulema will be the worst amonst people towards the end of time!!'--this is a reality prophesised by Our Beloved Master SAW. However, I put it to all my brothers and sisters on this site, that striving or 'dreaming' to make Sunni Unity a Reality, whether it exists anywhere or not, is far better and more fruitful than slinging it out with 'THE OTHERS'. There is a time and place for the slinging too Insha'allah, for we are on the HAQQ and we have nothing to fear, BUT we need diplomacy and tact going forward---that is not to say that we compromise our position, rather we organise, develop, train, do Tazkiyyah, learn, educate and become role models of Sunniism. FEAR NOT, DESPAIR NOT, BE PATIENT, BE STEADFAST, for ALLAH SWT is ''The Best of Planners''

ALLAH HAAFIZ!


 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3097
 Add post to community highlights
Posted 25.01.2004 00:49:13


Waxing Gibbous

Waxing Gibbous

Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 15.03.2005 14:32:49
Posts: 1 367, Visits: 0
as salam 'alaikum Brother Sajid

Mashallah, your words full of wisdom, where were yu before? Please keep posting your comments are what we need.



Ya Abu Bakar...Ya 'Umar.....Ya 'Uthman....Ya 'Ali


as salam 'alaykom wa rehmatuAllahi wa barakatuHu

 Add post for quality ranking
Post #3100
 Add post to community highlights
« Prev Topic | Next Topic »

«««12345»»»

Reading This Topic Expand / Collapse
Active Users: 0 (0 guests, 0 members, 0 anonymous members)
No members currently viewing this topic.
Forum Moderators: Tahir Riaz, Qadri Jilani, Ibraheem, Desert Sheikh, Mystic, Miss Qadri, passer by, Sunni Revolution, Quran Reciter, hanafi_student, Yaseen Dziaee, hamzah, The Sisterhood is Powerful, Ahle Sunnah Uprising, objective enquirer, Muhammad Al-Husayni, Sag-e-Darbar Jilani, Talibah, Abd Al Mustafa, Mohammad Mobasher, farishta, Imran., Sister Nur, fouzia attaria, Sunnni Muslimah, Faraz Hassan, ...S@Mr4h..., Know the Ledge, administrator

Permissions Expand / Collapse

All times are GMT +1:00, Time now is 10:39

Powered By InstantForum.NET v4.1.4 © 2010
Execution: 0,078. 8 queries. Compression Disabled.